Tai chi [太極拳/Тайцзицюань] (demo-scene)

Megalomaniak

Tomcat It has the cost of the depth pass, which is rendered regardless, so practically speaking almost free. Some compositing overhead I suppose. A drawcall.

Tomcat

v.3

Added:

water shader
skin shader (based on gd-character-creation, reworked)

Replaced:

wind effect flowers
Full screen: F11

Godot 4.3 RC 2

tai-chi_0003.exe 303 МБ

CRC32: B90E8AF8
MD5: 4DEC3B15EBAB5956FBA424E567BCC8E5
SHA-1: 459F42C46584F9447E9D05E3D4097AEB622B9F4A

tai-chi_0003.x86_64 286 МБ

CRC32: 653F9574
MD5: A8407383B5E095416D49F1B6B2C3D652
SHA-1: F2508A1B5CE32FC19ED8190467ADC20601143BCC

Gofile

musikai

Oh, I like this little demo.
Very relaxing, especially the movement of the trees and dancing little flowers.
As smooth as these wind-like movements Tai-Chi-Girl should move. But she has a bit to learn, she's micro trembling.
(Do you think you could smooth these animation keys, perhaps there are too many of them!?)

Tomcat

musikai Thank you for the response!

musikai (Do you think you could smooth these animation keys, perhaps there are too many of them!?)

I'm still just learning and exploring, but I suppose there is a possibility to make smoother movements.

Tomcat

I really dislike abandoned projects, about the reasons for which nothing is known. Better bad news than no news. With that concept in mind, here's how this project ended.

The disk died. It is especially cynical that it died during the creation of the archive. The piquancy is added by the fact that all diagnostic utilities (from proprietary to third-party) reported that the disk was perfectly healthy until the last moment.

Since the old archives were preserved, in principle, it is possible to restore the previous stage of work. But I don't see much sense in it. Since the main tasks have been accomplished. Namely the workflow of the possibility of creating a game (demo scene) with the joint use of free programs and assets (including recycled shaders) was checked.

What is not done:

Change of clothes (although it was laid out from the beginning).
Camera change.
Fixing (smoother) animation.
Environment (fog).

Conclusions

Disks are consumable.
When they say “do a backup”, they usually don't specify that this process heavily loads disks and reduces their uptime. Disk failure during this time is not a surprising phenomenon.
Math is a pseudoscience. Any probability has a fifty-fifty chance of occurring.

— What's the probability of meeting a dinosaur on the subway?
— Fifty-fifty chance of meeting one or not meeting one.

You should always prepare for the worst case scenario, so that the less worst case is a pleasant surprise.

I'm not even going to talk about the “it works, don't touch it” nonsense right now.

Jesusemora

Tomcat that is horrible

Tomcat When they say “do a backup”, they usually don't specify that this process heavily loads disks and reduces their uptime. Disk failure during this time is not a surprising phenomenon.

when they say "do a backup" it means on the internet, or in some media like CD-Roms, DVD... I'm sounding old aren't I? pen-drives?

Tomcat Math is a pseudoscience. Any probability has a fifty-fifty chance of occurring.

no, math is obscure arcane magic from hell, that's why they use those eldritch symbols instead of code.
also, I think that's how they calculate PI these days.

Tomcat You should always prepare for the worst case scenario, so that the less worst case is a pleasant surprise.

Everything that could go wrong WILL go wrong.
-Murphy's law

TahaB

This looks like a fantastic project, and I’m really impressed with the variety of tools and assets you’re using! Godot 4.3 beta 3 combined with Blender and MakeHuman should make for a powerful setup. The attention to detail, from the camera controls to the planned features like wind effects and water shaders, shows a lot of thought and effort.

I’m curious to see how the water shader and clothing changes turn out. Have you considered any specific shaders or techniques for the water? Also, integrating a wind effect on the trees could add a lot of realism to the environment.

Regarding donations, if you’re open to suggestions, platforms like Ko-fi or Buy Me a Coffee are popular among developers for small business scale contributions. They’re straightforward to set up and can be a good way to gather support from your community.

Looking forward to seeing the progress and the final release on GitHub and other platforms!

Tomcat

Jesusemora that is horrible

It's a tragedy yeah, but it's not a catastrophe.

when they say "do a backup" it means on the internet, or in some media like CD-Roms, DVD... I'm sounding old aren't I? pen-drives?

I meant that there is active reading from the disk, when the controller is working in a heavily loaded mode and can fail. Which is what happened in my case. And the backup, also — yes, is done to another medium anyway. It doesn't matter if it's via the Internet or like me — usually to a nearby disk, but in this case I tried to upload to GitLab.

The old archives are still there because they are on another disk. It looks like I need to buy an HDD — it's more reliable, and in case of its death it's easier to get the information out.

Everything that could go wrong WILL go wrong.
-Murphy's law

Unfortunately, as practice shows, what can't go wrong, also goes wrong.

Tomcat

MikeCL The page has a bunch or warnings still though.

??!! I checked now through Tor Browser, that is without login and I didn't get any warning… what kind of warnings are you getting?

I'll give it a go, is it on Windows?

The main platform is Windows. I'm making a Linux version, but can't test it to see if it works. In fact, at the current moment I consider it already obsolete (not technically, but mostly morally — I've outgrown it). And am doing the next work, but actually a continuation. I want to make some “action” — maybe it will attract attention.

The theory that was voiced to me, says that my work is ignored (probably) because they believe that they are made by a Russian (although in military documents my nationality is indicated as “Ukrainian”, but in fact I have a different nationality) and that the demo version of Chinese gymnastics — and now authoritarian regimes are not very in vogue. And that's the only theory I've heard. (Yeah, politics can't get away from it.)

xyz

Tomcat The theory that was voiced to me, says that my work is ignored (probably) because...

Likely for more trivial reasons. Your description clearly states it's a demo scene and a study project. Couple that with rather bland visuals (which I already hinted on if you remember), and no wonder that hardly anyone will be interested. It's immediately apparent there's no much fun in there. Why not make an actual game? Something fun to play with. You could also get away with far less ambitious visuals if you employ some decent gameplay.

MikeCL

Tomcat I sent you a DM with a screenshot (didn't want this to take up too much attention as it's already a bit off-topic). I did notice that the one you linked here is different from the one you linked on your project thread. I will check it out.

Update: I played your Tai Chi demo... Gave you some feedback in your project thread 🙂

DaveTheCoder

I don't get any warnings in Firefox, Chrome or Vivaldi, on Ubuntu 24.04.2.

Tomcat

xyz Why not make an actual game?

Because, uh

Gotta be able to walk before you try running.

it's a step on the road to “the actual game.”

After all, “rather bland visuals” is also a feedback.

xyz

Tomcat xyz Why not make an actual game?

Because, uh

Gotta be able to walk before you try running.

Yeah but imo "walking" in this case would be a playable 2D thing, not a couple of 3D assets under default-looking lighting and a basic character controller. It looks exactly like what it is - a beginner learning project. You can't realistically expect anyone to be interested in that enough to download the executable. With an actual game you can at least pique some curiosity about how it plays, regardless of how it looks.

If you still only want to provide some sort of a walking simulator, the key to make it appear interesting on screenshots is to conjure a mood, which brings us back to visuals, not so much assets themselves but primarily environment design and lighting. I wrote about it in your project thread, even posted an image iirc.

MikeCL

I think it's off to a good start. and to be honest, I don't think graphics is the biggest issue here (that can be iterated on). I would focus more on getting more interactivity in there. Here's some top of the mind things:

Replace the fly camera with a proper "player" camera to ground the player a bit more in the experience
I don't think fog is necessary for this demo. Fog is mostly used to simulate distance (atmospheric/aerial perspective), if you are not targeting a certain mood that would require it from an artistic perspective, but having a bright sunny day with clean air like your environment, perhaps not. I would only include this if you are planning to have visuals further away.
Take a break from the visuals and focus more on making the demo more interactive.
Include some ambient sounds to make the experience a bit more immersive.
Maybe expand the "playable" area a bit. Perhaps with different sections where you can play with the girl? Tennis court?
If you are going to focus more on visuals, I would work more on the pool, especially the 3D model. Usually, the edge is the same height as the floor. And then include details so it looks a bit more natural, like, how would people get in and out of the pool? Small details like this makes a big difference. Like steps under the water, or metal railings that people can climb, etc. Maybe a small trampoline board?

Tomcat

MikeCL Huge thanks for your feedback!

Most of these comments were planned to be implemented during the development of this demo. But the development is interrupted and I will implement them in the next work.

The main thing, of course

MikeCL I would focus more on getting more interactivity in there.

Perhaps with different sections where you can play with the girl? Tennis court?

The tennis court

Usually, the edge is the same height as the floor.

I took a ready model. The pool edge masks rough edges — a limitation of Sweet Home 3D in creating pits. This is something I need to work on further.

Tomcat

xyz You can't realistically expect anyone to be interested in that enough to download the executable.

There is no problem with “downloading”. The latest version has been downloaded more than 100 times and I didn't count on more than that (I didn't count on that number either). But it's surprising that almost nobody leaves any feedback. I'm not just talking about this particular demo, but other works as well. The thread on this forum is the only one where there was at least a little discussion, for which I am very grateful to the participants and which really helped.

I wrote about it in your project thread, even posted an image iirc.

I remember that picture. The colors there are certainly creepy, but I'll need to experiment with the atmosphere settings - it is. The visual effects of the atmosphere from a design standpoint have to be justified. What is the justification for purple fog on a clear sunny afternoon? Barring magic, none. 🧙

With an actual game you can at least pique some curiosity about how it plays, regardless of how it looks.

There's a rational grain to it. And after this demo, I can work on the gameplay.

Tomcat

xyz Yeah but imo "walking" in this case would be a playable 2D thing, not a couple of 3D assets under default-looking lighting and a basic character controller. It looks exactly like what it is - a beginner learning project.

Well, it is. Simple content creation programs and uncomplicated shaders. I just put it together in one place and checked how it looks together. If someone had done this before, I'd be interested to take a look and study it. But since no one has done it until now, I had to do it. Partly I had to refine the models a bit and rework the shaders.

On the one hand it could be interesting for developers as an example of simple content creation, on the other hand for players as a possible level of graphics in the game. If game developers would be interested, I would post the source code.

If everything presented in this demo is so simple, then why now, when the end of the quarter of the first century of the third millennium (sic) in the games are still found static trees and water? About the skin shader I'm not even talking about.

We had 5 character models, 3 houses, 10 trees, many kinds of shrubs and flowers, several trucks and cars… Also, seamless textures, music effects, models of various household items. Not that we needed all that for the gamedev, but once you get locked into a serious game development, the tendency is to push it as far as you can. The only thing that really worried me was the shaders. There is nothing in the world more intricate, complex and crazy than designing shaders, and I knew we'd get into that rotten stuff pretty soon.

xyz

Tomcat The visual effects of the atmosphere from a design standpoint have to be justified.

The point wasn't to suggest the exact mood but to illustrate that you can drive the mood substantially away from the boring default in various directions using only 4 key technical parameters (lambert+ambient, cast shadows, ao, depth fog)

Tomcat What is the justification for purple fog on a clear sunny afternoon?

Mystery and a warm mood. Also a color temperature contrast between near and distant objects. Btw it wasn't purple but very light pinkish orange 😉

More rationally speaking, in the late afternoon (aka "the magical hour"), the sky can have all kinds of warm hues near the horizon. The distance fog caused by atmospheric scattering will take on those hues as well.

Games use this a lot. Just one quick example:

In general, you should never interpret colors literally and in isolation (grass is green, sky is blue...). This is an extremely naive and crude way of experiencing color. It's the engineer's way, not the artist's way. It will result precisely in that "default" 3d look you ended up with. To generate interest and mood, you can vary or exaggerate hues in all kinds of expressive or unexpected ways. You won't compromise the suspension of disbelief as long as your basic lambertian illumination and cast shadows are kept correct in terms of tonal values, and they always are with computer rendering.

Tomcat

xyz The point wasn't to suggest the exact mood but to illustrate that you can drive the mood substantially away from the boring default in various directions using only 4 key technical parameters (lambert+ambient, cast shadows, ao, depth fog)

When talking about color, this picture should be in front of the eyes

All the beautiful effects become dull on simple monitors. This is something to keep in mind.

Games use this a lot. Just one quick example:

This is clearly an advertising screenshot. It is interesting how it looks like in the game. The title "the magical hour" itself implies a very short period of time. In games with seamless daytime change, this will turn into a few seconds of real time for the player. The effort spent on implementation in such a case is not rational and therefore not found in such games. It can be justified from a design point of view only if in a particular episode the action takes place at a particular moment of the day and the game time is close to real time. Therefore, the episode should have a time limit (1-1.5 hours).

I'm going to investigate the implementation of weather and atmospheric phenomena, but these are clearly not priorities at the moment.

MikeCL

Happy to help!

Nice, already thought about the tennis court hehe.

xyz

Tomcat We're talking games here. A game might choose to sustain the same visual mood regardless of actual passing of time. It can also choose to exaggerate the intensity of a mood. Many games do both of those things, e.g. all installments of Dark Souls. And it works perfectly, keeping you immersed in a particular (pleasant) mood for as long as you play. So yeah, in a game, you actually can have the magical hour that lasts for literal days, without anybody complaining. Doing "illogical" things like this for an impact is what we call artistic/poetic license

One last remark; mood is not really about weather or atmospheric phenomena. Visual mood is primarily controlled by lighting. All 4 technical parameters I've mentioned before fall under broader category of lighting.

kuligs2

Tomcat Call me crazy but whats with the obsession of vertical screens? This trend is outrageous imo where when you go watch a video on PC and instead of full screen the video uses only at most 1/4th of the screen ..

Also i see someone is total commander enjoy-er

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